RIPPLE SALVO… #952… THE PACE OF PEACE TALK WAS ACCELERATING–IN PARIS, SAIGON, HANOI, WASHINGTON AND MOSCOW–AND THE CESSATION OF OPERATION ROLLING THUNDER WAS ON THE HORIZON… 18 DAYS going north TO GO. One of the interesting cards played by the US was a comparison of the number of American warriors killed and wounded reported by the North Vietnamese with the actual losses of the U.S. over a specific period…. See below…but first…
GOOD MORNING… Day NINE HUNDRED FIFTY-TWO of a look back of 50-years to the years of Operation Rolling Thunder over North Vietnam…
HEAD LINES from The New York Times for Sunday, 13 October 1968…
THE WAR: Page 21: “ENEMY REPULSED SOUTH OF DANANG–Marines Kill 31 In Beating Off Attack On Bivouac”… Joseph Treaster…”North Vietnamese soldiers fought to within 100 yards of United States marine positions near an outpost 30 miles southwest of Danang today before being turned back. An American military spokesman said the enemy forces left 31 dead when they broke off the attack on the marine unit’s overnight bivouac positions. The marines lost 8 dead and 20 wounded. The marines were part of a large force that for more than two weeks has been maneuvering around the two small outposts of Anduc and Thuongduc, which intelligence officers believe are threatened by elements of three North Vietnamese regiments… Although hundreds of American and South Vietnamese troops are engaged in the operation around the two outposts there has not yet been any major fighting. Two helicopters assisting in the marine operation collided Friday in flight about five miles east of the outposts. All 12 men aboard the two aircraft–an H-34 and a CH-46–were killed. In other action, United States marines operating just south of the Demilitarized zone near Conthien, killed 26 North Vietnamese. Three Americans were killed and 20 wounded. Inside the military zone, other marines said they found 100 fortified bunkers and 18 bodies of North Vietnamese in graves. American infantrymen operating in the Mekong Delta 17 miles southwest of Saigon said they killed 41 of the enemy in three brisk actions. Five Americans were killed.None wounded.”… Page 18: “NEGRO SHARE OF BATTLE DEATHS HAS DECLINED SLIGHTLY TO 13.7%”… “The percentage of Negro servicemen killed in Vietnam has dropped slightly. Meanwhile, the percentage of Negroes serving in the war has climbed a bit. These developments are reflected in a new Pentagon summary of Negro participation in the armed forces. The summary, setting forth the situation as of mid-1968, became available yesterday. It shows that as of June 30, 134.7 per cent of the 25,616 American servicemen killed in action from 1961 until that date were Negro. This represents a decline of 0.4 of a percentage pointy from the level reported up to the end of 1967. The ratio of Negroes serving in the Vietnam war stood at 10.5 per cent of the total as of June 30. This was seven-tenths of a percentage point greater than the figure as of December 31, 1967…. There were 629,729 Americans involved in the war as of 30 June 1968…Negroes account for 9 per cent of all Americans in uniform as of 31 December 1967. Thus the percentage of Negro participation in the war is 1.5 points higher than the overall share of armed forces as of mid-1958, and the share of battle deaths is 4.7 percentage points higher than the over-all figure.”…
PEACE PROSPECTS: Page 24: “SAIGON CRITICIZES FRENCH FOR ADMITTING TWO VIETCONG”… “The South Vietnamese Government said today that it deeply deplored the French decision to allow the National Liberation Front (Viet Cong) to open an information bureau in Paris.”… Page 1: “BUNDY PROPOSES TROOP REDUCTION AND BOMBING HALT–Former White House Aide Alters Stand on Vietnam Policy He Helped Make–Defends ’65 Decisions–But He Says ‘Burden’ Must Be Lifted ‘From Our Lives’ Beginning Next Year'”… “McGeorge Bundy, who supported the escalation of the Vietnam war when he was a foreign policy aide to President Kennedy and Johnson called yesterday for a de-escalation. ‘We must begin to lift this burden from our lives,’ Mr. Bundy, president of the Ford Foundation, told a symposium on law, liberty and progress at DePauw University, Greencastle, Indiana. ‘Americans simply will not support the current level of cost and sacrifice for another period of years. It is now plainly unacceptable that we should continue with an annual cost of $30-billion and an annual rate of sacrifice of more than 10,000 American lives. It is equally wrong to accept the increasing bitterness and polarization of our people. There is a special pain in the growing alienation of a generation which is the best we have had. So we mut not go on as we are going.” Bundy said the war could not be won. Her ruled out further escalation, seeing ‘no prospect of military victory against North Vietnam by any level of United States military force which is acceptable or desirable, ether in our own interest or in the interest of world peace.’“… STATE DEPARTMENT. HISTORICAL DOCUMENT. Document 64, a telegram from the Embassy in Saigon (Bunker) to Rusk and the President in Washington. Bunker reports that Thieu is on board for the developing possibility that the bombing of North Vietnam will be stopped in order to move into a new phase of talking in Paris, to include seats at the table for both South Vietnam and the NLF (Vietcong)… read at…
https://history.state.gov/historicaldocuments/frus1964-68v07/d64
HEAD LINES: Page 1: “PANAMANIAN COUP DISTURBING TO U.S.–Rusk Voices His Concern As Relations Are Suspended–Colonels Form Hunta”… Page 1: “ASTRONAUTS MOVE APOLLO 7 CLOSE TO BOOSTER ROCKET IN TEST OF SPACE RESCUE– Day of Troubles–Schirra Balks At Television Broadcast to Earth Citing Difficulties”… Page 1: “SPORTS:”100,000 See Olympic Opening In Mexico Stadium”… Page 1: “HUMPHREY VOWS ACTION ON CRIME–On Nationwide TV He Says, He Would Widen Federal Help For Communities”… Page 1: “NIXON WEIGHING HIS FINAL MOVES–Campaign Schedule and TV Debate On Florida Schedule”… Page 1: “LOCAL CONTROL OF SCHOOLS A GROWING NATIONAL PROBLEM–Another Strike Due–Negroes Priority Demand”… Page 1: “REPORT OF A MOSCOW-CAIRO DEAL ON ARMS DISMAY TO U.S. OFFICIALS”… Page 20: “NAVY CONCERNED ON SOVIET MISSILE–Feels It Is The Only Threat to Battleship New Jersey Off Vietnam Coast”… Page 55: “CYCLES OF RIOTS IN U.S. RECALLED–Expert Says Nation Forgets Its History Of Violence”… Page 58: “STUDY FINDS COURT MORE LIBERAL NOW ON CIVIL LIBERTIES”… Page 77: “Strom Thurmond Promotes Nixon’s Cause Deep In Wallace Country”… Page 79: “LeMAY ACCUSES HECKLERS OF BEING COMMUNISTS”…
13 OCTOBER 1968… OPERATION ROLLING THUNDER… New York Times: No air operations coverage north of the DMZ…VIETNAM: AIR OPERATIONS (Chris Hobson) There were two fixed wing aircraft lost in Southeast Asia on 13 October 1968…
(1) COMMANDER QUINLEN ROBERTS ORELL, and LT JAMES D. HUNT were flying an A-6A Intruder of the VA-52 Knightriders embarked in USS Coral Sea and lost at sea while egressing from a night strike south of Vinh. After completing their mission they received a Fan Song SAM radar signal and reported the activity to the orbiting EKA-3B, which promptly jammed the enemy radar. However, just after the Intruder crossed the coastline 20 miles southeast of Vinh, it disappeared off the scope of a ship offshore that had been tracking the strike. An extensive search failed to find any trace of the aircraft or the two night strikers. CDR ORELL and his B/N LT HUNT remain where they fell on the battlefield 50 years ago this day. They are recorded as XX–“Presumptive finding of death… Killed in Action.
(2) CAPTAIN MICHAEL JOHN “BAT” MASTERSON was flying an A-1C of the 602nd SOS and 56th SOW out of Nakhon Phanom on a night strike in Central Laos as Firefly 26 and lost his primary attitude instruments in heavy weather conditions. “After nearly an hour in the air and close to their target area, Captain MASTERSON’s aircraft developed gyro difficulty forcing him to abort the mission. The instrument failure in instrument flight conditions led to a case of severe vertigo and CAPTAIN MASTERSON radioed his wingman that he was bailing out of the Spad. The wingman, who was separated from CAPTAIN MASTERSON, reported seeing a bright orange fireball and explosion on the ground. No parachute was observed or beeper heard. A C-130 flareship arrived about 10 minutes after the crash to further refine the crash site by dropping flares. A ground team was put in to search for CAPTAIN MASTERSON on 24 October 1968 but was forced to withdraw before reaching the crash site due to the presence of hostile forces. Search results proved negative for CAPTAIN MASTERSON. He was immediately declared missing in action. In 1978 he was declared presumed dead. On 9 August 1993 a joint JTF-FA team investigated Firefly 26’s crash site and found enough evidence to declare the wreckage as that of an A-1 Skyraider. However, they found no trace or indication that the pilot was in the aircraft at the time of the crash. In 2005 remains thought to be those of CAPTAIN MASTERSON were repatriated to the U.S. and positively identified in February 2005 as Masterson’s, who was promoted to Colonel during the time he ws carried as MIA. Fifty years after his final flight, COLONEL MASTERSON is remembered with respect and admiration. Glory gained, duty done–he rests in peace…
SUMMARY OF ROLLING THUNDER LOSSES (KIA/MIA/POW) FOR THE FOUR 13 OCTOBER DATES OF THE FOUR YEARS OF THE OPERATION OVER NORTH VIETNAM…
1965… NONE…
1966… 1LT MURRAY LYMAN BORDEN, USAF… (KIA)… and… 1LT EUGENE THOMAS MEADOWS… (KIA)… See RTR for 13 October 1966 for detail… They were lost on a night dive bombing mission north of the DMZ…. An interesting note from the remembrances left at POWNETWORK for LT BORDEN dated 21 July 2009 by Colonel W.J. (Joe) Latham Jr, who was a close friend of Murray Borden and a fellow F-4C pilot. Among his excellent comments: “The major problem with weapons delivery from an F-4C at night, especially a dark night, was that the gunsight had only a red pipper in the middle of a fixed red circle–there was no roll tabs projected onto the sight’s combining glass to indicate the degree of bank. When looking at the target through the sight, the Aircraft Commander (front seat) had no reference as to whether the plane was in a wings level dive, a shallow bank, a steep bank, or even inverted. One had to keep glancing down to the attitude indicator to check the bank and dive angle, and then had to look back through the sight to reacquire the target. At 450 knots (approximately 500-mph), it was very easy to misjudge distances at night, and delaying a pull-out by a split second could be fatal. Once there was some fire on the ground (from bomb damage), we would often let the leader’s flares burn out so that we would not expose ourselves to the enemy while making a low angle weapons delivery below the height of the flares. Once the light from the flares was no longer available, it was much more difficult to judge distances and closure rate. All exterior aircraft lights were turned off and we made frequent radio calls to the other plane in the flight to keep them apprised of our relative position to the target and to each other.”…
1967… LCOL EDISON WAINWRIGHT MILLER*, USMC… (POW)… and… 1LT JAMES HOWIE WARNER, USMC… (POW)… See RTR for 13 October 1967 for detail…
1968… COMMANDER QUINLEN ROBERTS ORELL, USN… (KIA)… and… LT JAMES D. HUNT, USN… (KIA)… ( A remembrance left by Mark Scott, AQ1, USN, for LT HUNT at the VVMF, WALL of FACES is a memory for sharing. Mark Scott wrote: “You were my Division Officer and that last launch you were in my aircraft. When we turned into the wind the stack gas from Coral Sea was bad and you gave me your O2 mask and we shared…. Went to the wall and left a Pink Panther for you because that is what we called you in the line shack. And I have been wearing your bracelet since 1969 or 70. I found it in Seattle when we came back from that cruise. I will never forget you or your family. God bless them.” Date 7 June 2008)… oohrah…
RIPPLE SALVO… #952… BODY COUNTING…AN UNAVOIDABLE MEASURE OF EFFECTIVENESS IN WARFIGHTING. But fraught with unreliability. The New York Times published the following table of American casualties for a short period in August-September 1968 that was presented to the North Vietnamese Peace talkers in Paris to let them know that their Body Counting system was a bit off track. Inflated and useless for their decision making. The short article is dated 9 October from Paris. Headline: “U.S.ENEMY STATISTICS”… “Following are recent battle statistics cited by Ambassador at large W. Averell Harriman, chief American negotiator, at the meeting today with the North Vietnamese. Mr. Harriman voiced the fear that the leaders in Hanoi might be miscalculating the trend of the war on the basis of widely exaggerated and grossly inflated statistics.”
DATE PROVINCE NVN BODY COUNT ACT U.S KIA/WIA
Aug 24 Tayninh 200 wiped out 8 kia/45 wia
Aug 25 Tayninh 300 kia or wia 6 kis/ 51 wia
Aug 29 Thuathien 400 annihilated 9 kia/ 25 wia
Sept 3 Longan 150 casualties 4 kia/ 22 wia
Sept 7 Quangduc 150 kia 9 kia/ 29 wia
Sept 15 Longan 100 wiped out 4 kia/ 12 wia
Sept 16 Tayninh 451 annihilated 4 kia/ 48 wia
Sept 19 Binhduong 100 casualties 0 kia/ 3 wia
Sept 19 Tayninh 350 kia or wia 3 kia/16 wia
TOTALS 2,301 47 KIA/ 251 WIA
“In Operation Junction City, from 21 Feb to 2 April 1967, allied casualties were put at 289 killed and 1,552 wounded. Hanoi claimed a toll of 15,500 killed…” Humble host opines that exaggeration is not limited to one side or the other… In the past week I quote a Historical Document that stated the enemy losses in the last ten months of 1968 were “over 150,000 killed, plus the thousands killed by B-52 and other air attacks, or who died of wounds or disease, or were captured, or defected, or were eliminated by arrest.” (d61)
RTR quote for 13 October: McGEORGE BUNDY, October 1968: “One course remains a fundamental first necessity for the next administration. It must decide that it will steadily, systematically reduce the number of American casualties, the number of Americans in Vietnam and the dollar cost of the war. It must make this decision without bargaining or negotiation and establish it as a fact of American policy which must be recognized by friend and foe alike, and shared in, as they decide, by the other allies of Saigon. By 1971, if the war still continued, the American force in Vietnam could be cut low enough to be fought exclusively by volunteers.” Mr. Bundy proposed “drastic increases in our rewards for extended service in Vietnam,” arguing that “a force which rotates every 12 months is no force for this kind of war,” and he asked for reforms in the legislation and management of the Selective Service System.
Mr. Bundy’s last point: The contest in Vietnam is for the allegiance of the South Vietnamese people and no foreign force can win that battle.
Ditto Afghanistan…
Lest we forget… Bear